break the law, but wink wink, go ahead, stop cancelling people's policies, you can trust me not to prosecute you. we're living through the largest unraveling of a presidency in modern american history. what he said today is so deemedly disturbing, we're going to let you see it. watch this. at 52 years of age, the president finally is learning what almost every american adult already knows. >> what we're also discovering is that insurance is complicated to buy, and another mistake that we made i think was underestimating the difficulties of people purchases insurance online and shopping for a lot of options with a lot of costs and a lot of different benefits and plans. >> now, van, let me just ask you for a second -- if a guy tells you he didn't realize it was complicated to buy insurance, do you really want him in charge of

the entire insurance system for the country? >> look, i don't even know where to begin with that opening. first of all, dictator? you know last week if he's not taking responsibility, when he takes responsibility he's a dictator. that doesn't make sense. he mae as well be barack pinata. whatever he does, you guy -- him. >> we have recall grijalva, and republican steve -- i know you -- before we get into that, the president didn't just say he's getting picked on for saying. he also said i feel deeply responsible. he said it's on me. he said i've got to work to win back credibility.

he said i'm not a perfect president. i'm going to get it fixed. this is the kind of leadership you've been wanting. aren't you produce of the president today? >> what i want the president to do is admit this law doesn't work and work with republicans. look, van, if you want good policy, you have to work with republicans and democrats. he didn't want to do that the first time. at the law is not working now. he's acknowledging it, just not admitting it's unworkable. >> congressman, the law is working right now. >> for who? >> how about this? >> for all young people, for the women who can't be discriminated against. you rush past the good stuff and go to the things that aren't working. >> i'm against all the women who are having their good health care plans canceled. i've gotten so many e-mails and calls, that have had plans canceled. "forbes" just came out with a

report today that for every one person who's gotten a policy under the president's health care law, 50 people lost the -- do you think -- >> and the president came out to try to fix that. i know you're going to work with him to help fix it. >> at the president today -- this is just a practice matter. the president today said that implementation of his new proposal would rely on the insurance commissioners of the states working with the insurance companies. literally by the time he finished talking, within less than two hours, washington state insurance commissioner, who is a democrat came out and said flatly this will not work, we will not implement it. the national -- these are not the insurance companies that democrats like to attack. these are the insurance commissioners. on a bipartisan basis, they said it is unclear how as a practical matter the changes proposed today by the president can be put into effect. in many states, cancellation have already gotten out to

policyholder and rates and plans have already been approved for 2014. changing the rules through administrative action at this date crazy uncertainly and may not address the underlying issues. aren't you concern not on ideology and all that touch, but just on a program matter that the people the president is calling on to do this, within hours have said we can't do it. >> the concern -- thank you. the concern is for the private insurances. private insurances have resisted the affordable care act from the get-go and this is a risk involved. i think the president's proposal is an effort to try to move this along and allow people to have options, about if you're asking me the risk, the sole reliance on the private insurance companies that have canceled

people at this point, to allow them to go back on, to allow them then to look at options, and to keep that moratorium for a year is a risk. i agree with you. i don't know if it's so much the commissioners involved in that decision making as it's going to be that carrier and that private insurance company. >> aren't you glad the president did step forward with some constructive solutions? >> absolutely. you know, the hit on the president has been that he's sitting back and watching this whole thing unravel. what the president did today i think took a lot of guts. >> i think so. >> you owe up to something, and you propose a fix. >> and speaking of fixes. the president has put forward a fix that will let people getting these notices have a better chance. aren't you a co-sponsor of this terrible upton proposal that supposedly will keep people on their plans? but if you look at it, you look

at this proposal that you're a co-sponsor of, it doesn't require these insurance companies to keep them on the plan. it lets insurance companies forever to keep dumping people, duping people. how do you support a terrible law like this and say obama is wrong? >> first, van, it doesn't do the thing you describe. it gives a bit of power back to people. it says if you like the plan you have, you can keep it. it's not just you. if somebody else has the same ability to go and get that plan. one thing you're failing to mention. they went further to say this move by the president today would actually increase costs even more. it's not just the cancellation. millions are losing their good plans. another broken promise by the president was that his law would lower costs. we're seeing people have higher costs. >> and some higher and some lower, but crier plan allows -- it does not require these insurance companies to keep those plans. it allows it.

what it really does is it's a back door, opening the back door for our system, does it allow or require? >> first of all, it's not a man daylight, because the mandates have raised the costs. this came out in our hearing with secretary sebelius a week and a half ago. people are just fed up with washington about. the president's health care law says even if you have a plan you like, we don't think it's good enough for you. some bureaucrat can sake i think you have a lousy plan even if you like it. the real problem should have been -- >> you know, the -- the point my colleague is making is midled. muddled because w50e6g9 to 43-plus efforts at the house level to defund. and looking at default right in

the eye, as a consequence of, again, getting rid of the affordable care act. you can't be denied for preexisting conditions, you can't -- i think those are all fine, necessary steps to get health care, and the 33 million uninsured that suddenly have an opportunity in this country to get health care. >> let me ask you this. i think -- look, the slogans, the values are fabulous. as a practical matter, you have a president who has so mismanaged the internet access to this thing, you know, from the time they signed the bill through this month, they've had more time to get a website fixed than the entire second world war with the united states, and they couldn't get it to work.

apparently the i.t. people came to the president's staff and said this isn't going to work, period. now, the question i would ask you is -- today you have insurance commissioners who are bipartisan and the insurance companies saying this new thing isn't going to work. it's a practical them. great values, great ideas, people who are in charge making it work are saying it isn't going to work. doesn't it worry you on top of the i.t. disaster you could be about to have an obama insurance disaster in january of comparable scale? >> no. i think the i.t. disaster, let's use your word, newt -- is fixable. the effort to get that done is ongoing. we have 900,000 people registered on, waiting to see what options are going to have. that should have been expedited. it was unfortunate. i'm not defending the program and aisle not defending the computer.

what i'm defending is the substance of this legislation that was passed. >> i'm with you defending that, and also with you in defending the president. i watched the same news conference. you guys must be on the twilight zone. i'm going to tell you why people should be very proud of our president today. how much protein does your dog food have? 18 percent? 20? new purina one true instinct has 30. active dogs crave nutrient-dense food. so we made purina one true instinct. learn more at purinaone.com

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this situation. i think both parties should applaud him and try to work with them. this president stood up today, i was proud of him when he said this -- >> am i going to have to do some work to rebuild confidence around some of our initiatives? yeah, but part of this job is the things that go right, you guys aren't going to write about. the things that go wrong get prominent attention. that's how it's always been. that's not unique to me as president, and i'm up to the challenge. >> i just have to ask one thing. >> yeah. >> when you have a national website go down for 45 days, you don't have to write about it. i mean, the president's characterization misunderstands the scale of this disaster. >> first of all, and i think this is important to point out. a lot of his supporters say they

beat up on him because -- he's say every president get a tough time. i think there may be -- i think there may be a philosophical difference here. do you think that consumers protection is a value that the government can have a policy of consumer protects? you guys keep talking about government takeover and man dade, socialism, all solve of stuff. from our point of view, this is basic consumer protection. seat belts, insurance for your car, that's consumer protects. >> i'm all for consumer protection, but i'm also for empowering consumers. the problem with the health care law is that it takes away control from the patients and doctors and moves it over to the government. the president ahead a lot -- he didn't take about accountability. it's not just the website,

though, van. president obama has a crisis of credibility because of so many them. and you have things he promised that sounded great. they're literally taking dreams away from people who had good jobs. people are losing jobs because of this law. >> let me ask you, raul, i want to stip light my good friend here is very idealistic. what you said earlier, great ideals, but at a practical -- the president has a practical job. things are supposed to work. wouldn't it have made sense for him to bring in the insurance commissioners, had a meeting and said, will this plan work? it almost strings me that his speechwriters and political guys got together is let's do something. they came up with this thing, apparently did not check with

any insurance commissioners, and nothing it's being rue pewated. isn't there a practical part? >> there is a practical part, but i think the president's initiative is response that i need to fix that, and i -- you know, honestly it's not idealism, you expect leadership from a leaders. so this initiative, whether a meeting occurred or didn't occur with the commissioners, in my point of view, he needed to show leadership, that i understand that this is a problem in effectuating and implementing the whole plan, this is my initiative, this is how i want to deal with it. i thought it was necessary, appropriate and it was a good thing. what struck me today is this amassing contrast. we have two quotes from the president, one is from a month ago just before the website went up. i think if you listen to these,

it raises a very troubling question about the white house. not about the president, but the white house. >> there you can compare insurance plans side by side, the same way you would shop for a plane ticket on kayak or tv on amazon. >> i don't think i'm stupid around to say it would be like shopping on am zone or travelocity, if i thought it wasn't going to work. >> here's my very practical question again. the president of the united states has the biggest single thing in his domestic policy facing him, and apparently not on the senior staff told him what we now know from congressional testimony, the information technology people were saying, this is a really high-risk thing. when you look at iran, syria, doesn't it worry you that the president seems to be surrounded by people who cannot brief him, not information him, nobody is fired, nothing changes, so the same people who didn't inform him in october are still sitting there.

doesn't that worry you? >> no, it doesn't worry me, and i'll tell you why. i think in other situations, and other presidents, including clinton and bush, they had an advantage form the advantage is there was a cooperative atmosphere with the united states congress, particularly the house of representatives. my experience -- whether it is health care or any other initiative, the effort is to undercut and sabotage. not to try to final some middle ground. that is historic, even from the beginning of this whole discussion on health care. so for me, the white house being the principal adviser for him i think is necessary. the counter balance is not there. the house won't sit with this president and try to work out a middle ground. >> you sit here pretending like

you want to be obama's best friend. you're trying on gix obama care. you hate it. you're trying to repeal it. >> the things i don't like about it are what i see americans are seeing it do to their health care. in 2010 there was a federal report that came out that barack obama saw that said over 60% of people would lose their health care plans. he still went around the country saying if you like yours, you can keep it. we've offered time and time again on real solutions. going back to when the law was passed, they deliberately shut out republicans. it didn't take one amendment. they didn't want any of our good ideas. it is bad policy. >> one good republican idea was romney care which obama care is. so part of the thing, you were there. i was there. we were all there. it took longer to get obama care passing. when obama care got nominated.

it is very hypocritical. >> i'll give you a specific example. >> i wish you would tell the truth. >> during the time the president's health care plan was moving through congress, nancy pelosi was speaker. the president said multiple time if any republican has an idea they want put to on the table, i'll meet with any of them. myself and six other members of coming, including medical members of congress said we want to meet with you. not one time did we get an appointment with the president. not one time. we called the white house and said, we've got a lot of good ideas that will help solve problems. not one time with would have the president meet with us but he kept saying it on the campaign trail. >> the funny thing about history is that it doesn't necessarily repeat itself. it is there and it is fact. as we were going through the process of that vote for health care, it was the fact it, accommodations were made to the private insurance companies.

we gave up a public option. we gave up age groups because we wanted to make it work. those were concessions. >> this is going to be a great win. for now, stay here. next we cease fire. is there anything our two guests can agree on? we want you at home to weigh in on today's fireback question. do you think the president's fix for obama care will work? tweet yes or no using #crossfire. we'll have the results after the break.

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we're back with congressman. we've been chatting during break. one of the more interesting things we should tape sometime. is there something you think you and steve could find common ground on in. >> i think we can. the affordable care act was passed, validated by the supreme court. and there are premises. and what i think the president did today was to deal with a fix and in a very strong way of an issue that has come up with the health care act which politically is creating a lot of back lash. i think that's important. i think he is right. there are premises to that. benefits entitled to people that were not there before. preexisting conditions. young people, women, equity. those things.

they are core principles. >> i think the president would be able to rebuild some of his trust if he acknowledged, number one, he realizes the law is not workable now. maybe long term he and i would disagree on what we think happen years from now. at a mix, shouldn't we agree that while the law is not working, we should suspend the penalty that's american families would be hit with because right now, they cannot go to the webb and buy a product the law says they have to buy. otherwise they'll be penalized. suspend the penalty because right now you cannot even abide by the law. >> would you agree with that? if it is not fixed, we should find a by to not penalize people? >> i'm not ill apply anything but one of the sefrts to undermine a mandate. >> let me say thank you to you both. >> you can go to facebook or twitter to weigh in on our fireback question. do you think the president's fix for obama care will work in 30%

say yes. 70% say no. the debate will continue online at cnn.com/cross fire. >> join us tomorrow for another edition of "crossfire." erin burnett "outfront" starts right now. >> i am not a perfect man and i will not be a perfect president. >> president apologizes again and again and again. >> we fumbled. that's on me. >> i feel deeply responsible. we fumbled the rollout on this health care. >> is this enough to save his presidency? is he waving the white flag on his signature legislation or did he stop the bleeding and save obama care? let's go "outfront."